What's the point of the fail-first approach if people get stuck?

[edouard-lopez]

Hi there, thanks for the awesome work !

@DjangoGirlsBdx recently had a workshop in Bordeaux, France where many participants got puzzled by the error, which is ok, but some of them got stuck as the step was too big. Indeed, when the error is due to a file you have to create on the next page, but you don't even know you're required to have.
So how could one think of the solution?

Sure, the coach-es are here to overcome such situations, but the situation might be improved using different approaches:

• get the coach ready for this specific point (require recurrent coaches)
• a progressive approach: do it right then increase complexity
• add diagrams prior to code to explain the component at stake.
• probably other ways

What do you think?

Apologizes for the click-bait title 😛

update: improve source of confusion explanation.

[zerosoul13]

This just caught my attention as we are about to have our Puebla, México event. Could you kindly specify the missing file and also the steps to get this resolved? I would really like to relay the information to the rest of the coaches.

[vilmibm]

Indeed, when the error is due to a missing file you don't even know you're required to have how could one think of the solution?

Are you referring to one of the intended error messages in the tutorial? If so, which one? If you are referring to an error with the tutorial itself, it should just be fixed without a referendum on the tutorial itself.

If the scope of this issue is "I don't like the approach of this tutorial and it should all change" I don't really think it's a constructive or appropriate issue.

[edouard-lopez]

@zerosoul13 @nathanielksmith
Sorry, I expressed myself poorly, and it has generated confusion.

The views.py file is not created yet when introducting django urls and nothing to be found in this page as it will be created in the next page.
Hence, the participant are confused as they don't know their require another file to solve their issue.

Thus, coach-es can prevent this by giving an overview of the current task (adding a page) and the components at stake (urls.py, views.py, html file) and how the come together to make thing works. I realized the role of the coach to give this overview is crucial to prevent or unlock participants.

@nathanielksmith I'm posting feedbacks to see is the issue has/is/will be addressed. I and others from our team already have submitted issues and PR so I try to be constructive I can assure you of that.

[edouard-lopez]

related issue Reworking the order and pace of the tutorial #481.

[ierika]

@edouard-lopez @vilmibm

Sorry, I know this is a really old thread but it is still relevant.

I too have wondered about that. I had once mistakenly instructed a participant to do the views.py first before the urls.py knowing that it will just return an error.

Most of the participants already has basic programming knowledge to know that if they use a variable or an import that does not exist then it will certainly throw an error. Anyhow, I think Django is too niche of a subject for a real beginner.

Just a simple explanation like - in order to make a route, then you must first make a view would work in my opinion. So, as some of my fellow coaches in Django Girls Japan have suggested, why don't we add a graphical diagram to show the participants how things connect.

Any thoughts?